Via the Seattle PI, this spring the city of Seattle will be studying 6 potential routes for new streetcars, each of which would start downtown and reach out to other neighborhoods.
One of those would serve the west edge of the Central District, traveling up Jackson, north on 12th Ave, and then over to Broadway and Capitol Hill. The exact route will be evaluated in the study, which is due to be completed by May 1st.
Sound Transit had previously evaluated trolley routes going into the CD, including one that went up Jackson to 23rd Ave. But that one in particular had poor ridership estimates that kept it from getting any further in the process.
IMHO, the real focus should be on the corridor that the #3 and #4 busses serve. Those are almost always standing room only before they even get to downtown. Too bad we no longer have the James Street Cable Car.
The Jackson-12th-Broadway route described in the article is the same as the one that was proposed by Sound Transit in the Roads & Transit package last November. It was intended to provide the connection between the First Hill neighborhood and the light rail system (via the Int’l District and Capitol Hill stations) that was lost when the First Hill light rail station was eliminated from the north extension alignment due to engineering concerns.
I’m not sure if street cars are really the best investment or financailly suitable way to spend our transportaion money. This might add connections from downtown to Capitol Hill (The areas are already quite well connected.) but does nothing for the Central Area. In the meantime, The Central Area should advocate for improved public transportation between the Central Area and Capitol Hill. For those of who are willing to walk or bike 6 to 18 blocks it isn’t bad, but really to travel between the Broadway area or 15th Avenue a trasfer is necessary. Considering the close proximity this should not be necessary. Ensuring pleasant efficient bus services for all would be desireable. 12th Avenue has developed and may be in need of additional transportation options. Nonetheless it is only one or two blocks from the transportaion on Broadway, 15th Avenue and even the #2 crosses and serves a portion of that area. Street car rails are expensive and often problematic for the other trolleys, buses and autos.
I am a long-time fan and consumer of mass transit and feel strongly that Seattle must get the most bang for the buck (Pardon the cliche.) that is possible. Work harder on good buses and shuttle routes.
If they are to develop a street car please let it come into the Central Area around 23rd before it doubles back to Broadway.
First Hill and the Central Area have taken on quite a lot of density and desrve additional services and suppot.
Joanna Cullen
I’m not sure if street cars are really the best investment or financially suitable way to spend our transportation money. This might add connections from downtown to Capitol Hill (The areas are already quite well connected.) but does nothing for the Central Area. In the meantime, The Central Area should advocate for improved public transportation between the Central Area and Capitol Hill. For those who are willing to walk or bike 6 to 18 blocks it isn’t bad, but really to travel between the Broadway area or 15th Avenue a transfer is necessary. Considering the close proximity this should not be necessary. Ensuring pleasant efficient bus services for all would be desirable. 12th Avenue has developed and may be in need of additional transportation options. Nonetheless, it is only one or two blocks from the transportation on Broadway, 15th Avenue and even the #2 crosses and serves a portion of that area. Street car rails are expensive and often problematic for the other trolleys, buses and autos.
I am a long-time fan and consumer of mass transit and feel strongly that Seattle must get the most bang for the buck (Pardon the cliche.) that is possible. Work harder on good buses and shuttle routes.
If they are to develop a street car please let it come into the Central Area around 23rd before it doubles back to Broadway.
First Hill and the Central Area have taken on quite a lot of density and deserve additional services and support.
Joanna Cullen
If Portland’s experience is any indication, the streetcar is good at moving people in an urban core but not exactly a transit alternative for significant distances (say, 5 miles +). Moving people from downtown to Ballard on a streetcar would take as long as a bus. Moving people from downtown to adjacent neighborhoods (CD, Cap Hill, QA) might make sense, but putting a streetcar on an already packed road will not result in traffic efficiencies. The jackson to 12th ave corridor makes sense in that those are not heavily clogged arteries but are growing.
Your point regarding that the 12th Avenue route makes more sense than the one to Ballard is good. Nonetheless, Broadway is a well-served area by bus and is included in two of the street car plans. I have serious concerns about the efficiencies of such schemes. A Central Area-Broadway route serving the East Union corridor would also make sense if Seattle wants to spend mass transit dollars on street cars. If mass transit is to be supported and be favored in debates with mass transit vs roads using tax $ wisely is necessary on both sides. I suppose I should feel that since South Lake Union got its street car, we should all get one. Why not advocate for more to serve more of the Urban core? Is West Seattle the Urban Core? What is the cost per passenger trip and mile?
The fare for the South Lake Union bus is separate from Metro and yet we the tax payers are paying for both. Where is the integration of effort? Any plan that can solve the transportation headaches, associated pollution issues, and cut through all the politics for a reasonable price for the citizens would be welcomed by all I’m sure.
Joanna
I’d like to second Joanna’s suggestion for more transit links between the CD and Capitol Hill. There’s no easy way to get from here to there for dinner, drinks, movie etc without walking or driving. And walking is out for many folks in the cold, dark, wet winter months.
But as for streetcars as a technology, I’ve changed my opinion a bit after seeing the SLUT. Sure, it’s no faster than a bus, but since it’s fixed to a route it is a bit more dependable, especially if you’re only an occasional user. And it’s a much better experience for riders, with more room for people to stand and an overall more bright and open atmosphere.
Is that worth the extra expense? I tend to say yes since so much of it is a capitol cost for infrastructure that will be around for a long time, and the better rider environment will entice more folks to ride.. That fixed nature of it also prevents county politicians from getting creative with their allocations of funds. It’s harder to shift Seattle transit dollars to the suburbs if the trains and tracks can’t go with them.
That fixed nature of street cars is a whole discussion unto itself. Sure bus routes can be changed by county politicians, but they can also be varied in response to changing ridership and population density. It’s alot easier to move bus routes around than fixed street car tracks. But I think a more important discussion is planning for the future. We’ve seen the monorail rise and fall, and light rail is just now becoming a reality. While streetcars are great- in thinking ahead I think Seattle needs transportation that is faster than street level alternatives (bus, streetcar) and not subject to the whims of traffic. Get people off the streets. Give them an incentive to ride, because its faster and cheaper than being stuck in traffic. I don’t know what that technology is (subway, light rail, elevated rail?) and Seattle’s geography and topography are surely a challenge. But I’d rather invest in technology for the next century than the last. Imagine Seattle with a REAL mass transit system…like New York, Chicago, or DC. Imagine not just getting to Capitol Hill or Ballard, but to the tech centers of the eastside in an efficient manner. I’d buy into that.
Metro is suppose to respond to route suggestions. Yes, I agree that many different types of mass transit may be the solution. But, all routes and fares must be integrated into one system in order to use the precious transit dollars wisely. Please, no fiefdoms.
Still the transportation between the CD and Broadway and 15th Avenue areas should be easily more seamless. It is much easier to access Downtwon, Queen Anne, and the University District from here. More transit between the areas would reduce parking headaches and polution in both areas.
Joanna